I will be upfront about this, I am not a fan of DRM and locking any publication/music etc a single machine or device. I paid for it, I should be able to use the media the way I choose on any device I own.

That said here is my question. At the meeting in York it was stated the digital edition of OGR will be tied to one machine and will only be able to open on that one machine. How is OGR going to respond ever few years when a digital subscriber swaps out PC's? Or what happens when a machine fries a motherboard or drive and the DRM does not allow the issue to be read? Will OGR agree to unlock any previous purchased editions of the electronic delivery magazine for however long OGR or the customer is around?

DRM was an idea started by Apple and other electronic music retailers several years back to appease the record companies who are living in the past. However it has since been abandoned by most of them. DRM is a dead end and does nothing but inconvenience customers. Both WalMart Music and Circuit City's DiVX programs left customers who bought music and movies with unusable purchases when they shut down. Will OGR subscribers risk the same? The OGR electronic archives have been successful since they allow an easily transportable PDF version of OGR, the future version of OGR is not the same.

One way to look at the DRM issue , this would be just like saying that if you had a printed version of OGR you would have to never share it with a friend or left it somewhere (train club, bathroom) for others to read. I am very certain that 99.99999% of the subscribers of OGR are not going to pay for a subscription to an electronic version just so they can give it to their friends for free. And if they do, you may even get a new subscriber or two from those we get a chance to view the publication and like it (As for those who read it and never subscribe, you were never going to get them to subscribe anyway).

OGR management do not fear the future, embrace it, DRM is dead don't lock yourself and your customers into the DRM trap

I agree 100%. I've been waiting for OGR to offer a digital subscription for years, but if it is going to include DRM (especially DRM as restrictive as this "tied to 1 computer" nonsense) then I won't be subscribing.

I have to agree as well. I'm not a fan of DRM. Hopefully there is another solution.

I want to subscribe, being in Australia, a digital version is preferable but, I too would not like to be stuck with this. I am going to replace my computer when Windows 7 comes out, has been in the market for a while and seems to be sorted. I guess I won't subscribe now until that time comes.
I agree with the previous posts; doesn't make sense to me.

I have to agree as well. DRM is a dead end street as stated. I'd be happy if there were more editions of the OGR Digital Archives. The PDF format is the only way to go. IMHO

Chris and others,

Great points as I constantly switch between my desktop system and my laptop. For instance, this year I took my laptop to York since I was staying from Wednesday to Friday. If I D/L'd the OGR to my laptop, then I could have read it at my leisure at York. But while I'm home, I use my iMac 99% of the time such as right now.

BTW Chris, DRM was the solution that Apple had to come up with when they first negotiated for the right to sell music over the Internet. It's not that Apple wanted to do business that way but the RIAA insisted that the coding be included to prevent further piracy. No coding; no Internet sales; no iTunes store and probably not as massive number of sales of iPods. Apple didn't have much of a choice. And Jobs had to constantly defend the DRM as to not "P.O." the RIAA gods or they would have yanked the licensing.

Bill

Totally with you on this Chris. I also have multiple computers but am one person, so DRM is a total non-starter. When I travel, I like to take a netbook, which I rarely use at home since my laptop is superior. So which computer would you use? Or would use use a desktop?

I also have scanners, so if I really wanted a digital OGR or any particular article, I could scan and save. I know it wouldn't have the index and other advantages Rich is likely to include, but the ability to access it on more than one computer would more than offset that.

Gerry

I once spent a few months managing a project that involved some software that was DRM protected. This was back in the days of the "blue screen of death" on Windows NT4. The software was buggy and the installation would abort and sometimes crash the system. Every reinstall required a call to tech support for a new activation code, and every call was 20 minutes on hold. I HATE DRM with a passion. I agree with everything that has been said in the above messages.

I have to agree totally with Chris on this. I would not subscribe to any electronic subscription that limits me to one machine. I use the desktop in my office at home mostly but my laptop gets plenty of use too, especially even more lately taking it with me in the hospital and by my bed home while recovering and to not be able to read something I paid for because it is on another computer I own is ridiculous. Sorry OGR but while I applaud the progress in going to electronic subscription DMR is not the way to go.

Chris, I'm sorry we could not talk about this at York when we were standing together in the Gold Hall. I was pretty well out of it then, with a nasty chest/sinus infection that was in full blast at that time.

The use of DRM for paid subscription magazines is very common in the magazine industry. We are not doing anything unusual here. It is not "...living in the past..." rather it is the most common business model for electronic magazines with a PAID subscription business model.

The alternative - no DRM at all - means that any individual could download and freely distribute our product to anyone else. That is not fair to us because unlike some publications that encourage this, OGR is not a free magazine. We rely on paid subscriptions and advertising revenue to survive. OGR is nowhere near large enough to be able to offer the magazine for nothing and survive on ad revenue alone. Our circulation would have to be 10 times what it is to make that business model work. Several magazines with paid subscription business models like ours have ended up failing and going out of business because they published a digital edition with no DRM in place. Human nature being what it is, too many people were getting their magazine for free as a handful of others downloaded it and sent it to their friends.

Hiawatha, surely you don't think that the DRM of today is the same dinosaur that was state of the art with Windoze NT4! A lot has changed in this area in the 15+ years since Windoze NT 4 was state of the art. If you purchase a new PC or change a motherboard, the DRM can be changed to that machine...no big deal.

Candidly, I had not thought about those of you that travel a lot and use a laptop on the road for entertainment. I will look into what may be involved in allowing the use of two machines on a single subscription.

The bottom line is that we are trying to bring the world of digital publishing to the readers of our magazine and others who may be interested in O Gauge trains, while at the same time protecting our rights and our paid subscription business model. If there is an alternative process that can do this without DRM, you'll have to educate me.

Rich,

I thought long and hard about using DRM as a means to copy-protect The DCS O Gauge Companion and decided against it, due to both the real and perceived negative aspects of DRM. Rather, I used a password scheme with the password tied to the purchaser's Shopatron account password.

While not perfect and still subject to negative criticism, whether deserved or not, I truly believe that it's a better fit for a digital publication.

Rich,
Please assure me that by going with an electronic version, it is not the first step of dumping the printed version. I am not a fan of reading magazines, newpapers etc online. I much prefer the printed media. I have download many back issues of OST and have to admit that I have not read any of them.
I understand the need to try to reach a larger audience and that offering this publication via electronic sources may need to be done. I am also aware that there are many that would prefer the digital version, but in my opinion there is nothing better than sitting on the front porch and flipping through the pages of OGR. Thanks for a great publication.

Jim M;
I agree with you. It would be rather difficult to take the computer into the "reading room" at home. It's also less cumbersome to take a snooze in the recliner with a copy of OGR in your lap than with a laptop or netbook.
Let's hear it for the printed word.

DRM has got to be one of the more divisive issues we have in the computer age. If you favor it, you get branded greedy and insensitive the the end-user's needs for reasonable use. If you speak out against it, you're accused of advocating ease of piracy.

Now, both those views can be valid, but they are both heading toward the extremes. "Fair use" and convenience for the end-user while still protecting the publisher's rights is somewhere in the middle. Apple actually struck a decent compromise in their original DRM concept called "Fair Play" -- you could buy a music file and play it on a fixed number of computers, as long as each machine was "authorized" across your network from the one you bought the file on. So you could use the file on your desktop, laptop, and maybe your work PC (if your workplace allowed that...). The system is reasonably transparent to the end-user and offers some freedom while still protecting the purchased file -- it won't play on a computer that doesn't have the decryption key granted by the "authorization" function.

I think the key is replicating that kind of flexibility. If you make the DRM system non-intrusive while providing a product that the end-user finds value in, it can be successful. If the DRM system is too cumbersome and risks the end-user losing access to purchased content, it will not fare well in the cost-vs-value equation.

The downside? The more flexible the DRM system is, the more likely it is that someone will find a way to circumvent it. Apple's system can be bypassed, for instance. However, doing so consumes time. It consumes more time and effort than the average end-user wants to spend learning and running special software, when a music file can be downloaded for very little money. Therefore, the cost-value equation works in Apple's favor still. Losses from piracy may exist, but are negligible to Apple in the light of their total yearly revenue from music sales. (The RIAA would beg to differ, of course, but they're a whole different problem... ) The same situation exists in print. Magazines can be shoplifted. Someone can unstaple a copy, scan it into PDF format, and anonymously circulate the file on the Internet. But the risks and time invested in doing those things aren't really worth the price of a subscription or just buying a magazine. So again, the cost-value equation tips in the favor of legitimate means of acquiring the product.

Back issues, out-of print media and old versions of software present the worst DRM problems. When an object is no longer produced in any form, what happens to the DRM process? Will it or won't it work? When DRM becomes broken for whatever reason, cracking it becomes worthwhile to more end-users because there is no other way to obtain the item of value. This is where the more Draconian and/or poorly-conceived DRM systems generate ill will among end-users.

Digital publishing is still young and we really don't have an effective and transparent way to maintain DRM without overly limiting the end-user. Look at all the competing, incompatible e-book formats. None of them are interoperable with other e-book reader software and hardware. The process of buying an e-book from a Web vendor is awkward in many instances. (Find a vendor that sells the e-book in a format you can use, set up an account so that your reader's digital signature can be exchanged, download the file, possibly get an authorization code, hope everything works... if it doesn't, good luck...) Protected PDF's offer cross-platform capabilities, but still face huge tradeoffs in usability vs. protection systems.

In a perfect system, I'd like to be able to read a digital copy on my big desktop computer's monitor, my laptop when I'm traveling, and also on my iPhone so I can read an article or two at lunchtime. Seems simple, but all those devices have to be able to handle the media format as well as the DRM system. Computers aren't too hard to do that for, but mobile devices are a real jungle from an interoperability standpoint. Yet, mobile device compatibility can make or break "digital paper" formats these days because on-the-go reading is really what end-users crave.

Well, I've rambled enough, but hopefully I've tossed out a few useful thoughts.

In my own case, I still want a paper copy of OGR to peruse. I might enjoy a companion digital copy if I can keep it backed up both for reference months/years later and for reading on my iPhone on-the-go when it first comes out. For reading at home, though, I'll always prefer print. Digital is for convenience when I'm out and about and for archiving. If both of those needs can't be met, I'll forgo the smartphone option and just stick with print, then buy HSL's digital archive later on to have a digital backup. (I'll just read the forum at lunch on the iPhone, then. ) Just my two cents, but if everybody can chip in some useful feedback, I think you'll be able to figure out the strategy that will appeal to the most subscribers. Then maybe offer a month or two free to print subscribers who want to try it out, get their feedback, and fine-tune it for prime-time. "User Acceptance Testing" is what we call it in the computer biz where I work.

Cool idea, at any rate. As our trains take advantage of the digital world, it's worth investigating how our publications can transition there, too.
-Eric

I agree with Jim, I enjoy taking OGR with me on the back patio and flipping through it with a cup of coffee. It takes me a good week or two to read each copy cover to cover as I read a few pages at a time when I have time and it usually is in every room in the house during that time and I mean EVERY room, if you know what I mean.

Paul

Rich,

No problem about the Gold Hall meeting, I understand you were way under the weather.

I appreciate you looking into the DRM issue and getting back to us. I understand about OGR trying to protect their assets, but while DRM may protect the publisher it beats up on the consumer. Perhaps if OGR was a news magazine who's information rapidly goes out of date I would be less interested in looking at old copies and wouldn't worry as much, but I see OGR as a reference and I do not want to loose information that I may want to view several years down the line(why else would I still have all my back copies).

If I were to sign up for the electronic version my use of it would be along the lines of wanting to be able to read a copy at work, but when I travel load it up on the iPhone or the laptop (Is this DRM method Mac or PDA compatible?) Even if I was only interested in having it at home, I reformat and upgrade machines like some people change socks. I am very concerned about loosing access to the copies of OGR I have purchased electronically when I want to view it a few years down the line.

I just think in the long run you are going to cause yourself more headache than what you save. DRM assumes all the subscribers are out to get the content owner. When in reality only one or two people may be inclined to share the publication, but those same people probably share their print copy as well. I realize the internet allows for far greater sharing at the click of a mouse, but if you see it happening they try to address it with them.

DRM for music died when two thing were realized. First, the person most impacted by DRM were those honest ones who paid for the music in the first place and for whatever reason lost access to items they bought. And secondly many people who did download a song or two turned around and bought the entire CD after they heard the songs. A free download may in turn become free advertising There have been several studies out showing that "Illegal Downloaders" are actually very big purchasers of music. I think a few copies of OGR may just bring you more subscribers once those non-subscribers who see it realize its a magazine worth supporting.

Just some things to ponder, I think by many of the above comment though, DRM is not going to be too well received by those who may want to subscribe to an electronic copy.

The bottom line is that we are trying to bring the world of digital publishing to the readers of our magazine and others who may be interested in O Gauge trains, while at the same time protecting our rights and our paid subscription business model. If there is an alternative process that can do this without DRM, you'll have to educate me.

Rich, I would suggest that before you make this commitment to DRM, you should go back and take a 2nd look at my website, especially the ONLINE EDITION and the virtual edition that is available to see. This address is
www.bulletinboardva.com. You told me that ".......my website had nothing to offer forum members." Perhaps not, but I think it has something to offer YOU and OGR.

I'll subscribe to OGR digital version if and only if.

I can use (read) it on any of the 5 UNIX/Linux pcs in my house (I do not use Windows) I commonly use and if I can read it on my iPhone on the subway to work. If I'm restricted to 1 pc and no iPhone then the paper version is MUCH MORE PORTABLE then the digital one which is a step backwards. There's no DRM on the paper version why do we have to have it on the digital one?

You say you are using DRM to protect yourself. Fine ok, what then is used on the paper version that prevents some one from breaking the law and making copies of it? NOTHING!

I hate DRM so much, it's infuriating to buy a product (ie a movie) and have it be locked to 1 device. Seriously, rethink your DRM choices.

No! to digital. It may be somewhat acceptable for those who like "no paper", but not for me. You mean I would also need to buy a laptop so I can read OGR in the "throne room", not likely.

DGauss, Trainpop and others, there is no talk what so ever of stopping the print version, digital is only an optional subscription.

So don't panic

Three times at work I have had a hard drive crash. The MIS department was near worthless, the onus of retrieving the information was up to me. Also up to me is performing backup. The only guaranteed to be backed up is that which is put on the server. And yet ... they refuse to connect the testing computers to the network. I brought Norton Ghost from home to do the backups my self. I have also recently learned you want two hard drives, with the backups on both hard drives. Now, at home, I have to deal with backing up three computers, making sure nobody saves a file in a dumb place, making sure the important files can all fit on a CD without a bunch of dumb garbage that can be downloaded on the internet any day. And then I have software that has various locks on it, for instance, TGL Micro, a piece of software that allowed me to figure out the serial port for both TMCC and stuff at work. Then for the life of me, at work, a company that sells panel meters with a serial RS485 interface that has a 30 day install window for software that ONLY WORKS WITH THEIR METERS! Good grief, I would give the software away for free to try to entice the customer to buy more meters, but who am I. (I think Mike Wolf has a low price on DCS so that he can sell more engines. Smart man.)

The last thing I need is another piece of software that causes me agony. As I say to my wife, "You know, normally, I get paid for this."

Plus I am not taking a laptop into the can.

I will stick with the printed version.

I get "Consumer Reports" by signing in with a "user name" and a "password". They have a product simular to OGR and seem to feel this business model protects them and still is convenient for use on multiple computers. I like this because it is convenient and makes searching for areas of interest more convenient. Maybe someone more sophisticated in this area than I am can tell me why this does not work?
stan

Before this gets WAY out of hand with a lot of mis-information and people jumping to all kinds of illogical conclusions, let me clear up a few things

THE PRINTED MAGAZINE IS NOT GOING ANYWHERE. Just because we are going to publish an on-line edition does not mean the print magazine goes away! How anyone could draw that conclusion is beyond me. We recognize that most of our subscriber base is NOT going to prefer a digital edition as opposed to a printed magazine. However, there is a younger generation out there that "lives" on-line. They simply do not have the same preference for a printed book that most of you do. They live on line with their cell phones, texting, Twitters, Tweets, Facebook, MySpace and all the other on-line places where today's kids hang out. There are also certain high-tech types that may be older but also prefer to do their reading on-line. These are the people we are trying to reach with the OGR Digital Edition.

If you don't like an on-line magazine and prefer the printed version, that's fine! Stay with the printed magazine! However, if you don't intend to subscribe to the OGR Digital Edition, then don't continue to publicly complain here about something that is not going to affect you anyway.


SHARING YOUR PRINTED COPY OF THE MAGAZINE IS NOT THE SAME AS SHARING A DIGITAL COPY. If you share a copy of your magazine with a friend, there is still only a SINGLE COPY of the magazine involved...a single copy that was bought and paid for. However, if you make a copy of a digital file and give that to a friend, now there are TWO copies of something where only ONE was paid for. Sure, you could rip your magazine apart and spend a couple hours feeding it through a copier page-by-page to make a hard-copy for your friend, but seriously...who is going to do that? It simply takes too much time and effort as opposed to a "click - drag - done" that takes all of three seconds to copy a computer file.


And now the biggie...YOU DO NOT HAVE TO DOWNLOAD OUR DIGITAL EDITION IN ORDER TO READ IT. You can choose to read it on-line if you wish, in which case it is tied to a user name and password. Perhaps if I had remembered to mention this a little earlier in this thread my life would be a bit simpler this morning.

Rich, thanks for the additional info, and I think the online viewing is a good option. While I will still disagree with you about the other DRM issues, I appreciate the chance to discuss them with you.

quote:

And now the biggie...YOU DO NOT HAVE TO DOWNLOAD OUR DIGITAL EDITION IN ORDER TO READ IT. You can choose to read it on-line if you wish, in which case it is tied to a user name and password. Perhaps if I had remembered to mention this a little earlier in this thread my life would be a bit simpler this morning. Wink

So, where do I sign up?
Reading online, via a password suits me thanks.

I also have to chime in here and agree with Chris, Barry & some of the others here. DRM does put a sizeable degree of burden on the consumer. I have 2 home PCs and two laptops. When I travel I don't like the idea that my e-book will only work on one machine. And during some of my travelling (airline as an example) there are times where Internet access is not doable so the option of being able to view my digital copy online isn't going to completely solve the problem either. And as Chris has indicated already, what do you do if you suffer a hardware failure such as with the motherboard or NIC (depending upon what part of the hardware you are tying the license to) that requires replacement of that component or the entire system? You have a file that you paid for that's now useless, or a surmountable hassle to re-obtain so that it will work on the new machine.

Unless you provide a solution similar to some software companies out there that also use hardware-based licensing (i.e. tied to a system's MAC address) where one can do a "license transfer" to another computer (via online registration, email or phone), and make that process easy, I don't see this working out favorably for either the magazine or the end user.

Rich
Will, say, a year or more of back issues be on line so one can search for topics where one saw something but cannot remember when or wether it even appeared in OGR?

As far as I am concerned, being able to read it on line is very adequate for my retired situation! Maybe you could set up a two tiered process where only log ons are available at one price and then at a higher price an option that would allow the busy, high powered subscriber to have multiple computer download options. I would think with their lifestyle they can pay for the additional service! After all, more service usually means a higher price in this world!!
stan

quote:

YOU DO NOT HAVE TO DOWNLOAD OUR DIGITAL EDITION IN ORDER TO READ IT

That helps! A lot!

quote:

SHARING YOUR PRINTED COPY OF THE MAGAZINE IS NOT THE SAME AS SHARING A DIGITAL COPY.

Hmmm. It is if some one has a nice color copier and makes copies. Which is equally against the copyright law as making copies of the digital version and giving them away. The difference being it is much easier to share the digital version then it is the printed version.

Personally, I like what Barry did with his book. I can take that pdf to any device I own and read it, connected or not. Which would be really nice on my iPhone on the subway as I don't have a signal in most of the tunnels so I cannot read online content. I do have Barry's book on my iPhone however and can read it just fine.

I understand your desire to protect your work which is why I would buy it and never make copies to give away. I also understand that not everybody is the same way. Why not do it like Apple/iTunes? Allow 5 pcs per purchase instead of just 1. Also, allow me to de-authorize an old PC and re-authorize a new one. PC's (especially windows) get rebuilt, reinstalled, tossed out and bought new yearly for most people and others more frequently then that. So, anyway, to solve those issues people like me would like have the magazine on my iPhone, PC at my desk, PC at my home and my laptop when I travel and be able to move my license to a new pc when I get one. I would imagine that is what most people would ask for and depending on the DRM used this can be allowed for.

quote:

However, there is a younger generation out there that "lives" on-line. They simply do not have the same preference for a printed book that most of you do. They live on line with their cell phones, texting, Twitters, Tweets, Facebook, MySpace and all the other on-line places where today's kids hang out.

Ya... HI! That would be me. I am that audience. I'm exactly who you are talking about in that statement. I also have quite a lot of DRM hacking software to remove that crap from things I buy. I believe in fair use rights and support organizations like Defective by design and I hate the RIAA with a passion. Reason being, is I'd like to be able to purchase music (or any digital content) and then be able to play that music on my computer, my stereo, my iphone and my car. But, the RIAA and DRM seems to think I need to purchase 4 different copies to do that and god forbid I get a new car as my license for that song stays with the car! DRM is a BROKEN technology. It doesn't license a person to use your content it licenses a device. The device DIDN'T BUY IT, I did! I have the right to use what I purchased, the DEVICE doesn't have any legal rights so why does the device get to have the license!?!?!?!?

So ya anyway, just FYI, if you put DRM on your digital magazine I guarantee it'll be hacked within minutes by people just like me. No one (that I know of) bothered to hack Barry's book as there was no point cause that DRM was sold to the person and not to the device, therefore that person is not hindered by it and can read the book anywhere.

quote:

Originally posted by EricF:

Digital publishing is still young and we really don't have an effective and transparent way to maintain DRM without overly limiting the end-user. Look at all the competing, incompatible e-book formats. None of them are interoperable with other e-book reader software and hardware. The process of buying an e-book from a Web vendor is awkward in many instances. (Find a vendor that sells the e-book in a format you can use, set up an account so that your reader's digital signature can be exchanged, download the file, possibly get an authorization code, hope everything works... if it doesn't, good luck...) Protected PDF's offer cross-platform capabilities, but still face huge tradeoffs in usability vs. protection systems.

FWIW, awhile back Amazon pulled back electronic version of a book because of some licencing issue, so those who paid where out the money I think. While I seriously doubt Rich or OGR would "pull back" any OGR publication, a coralary would be OGR changing hands and the new owner deciding that digital back issues were no longer available except at a price.

Me, I'll take the print any old day.

If someone is determined to release a pirated copy of your magazine, they'll simply scan it in and make a pdf file. DRM only really hurts the honest people and does nothing to deter those motivated to post pirate versions. What happens 5 years from now when you get people calling and emailing saying they have a new computer now and their DRM copies of OGR no longer work. Is there a plan to address that situation? I hope so because it will happen.

The ability to view it online from anywhere is a good idea, however.

Rich,

Thanks for the clarification though I could have done without the lecture.

I also have to agree here, I have 2 home PCs and I travel for work every week I don't like the idea that my e-book will only work on one machine. So during my work week travelling (airline all the time) there are times where Internet access is not available so the option of being able to view my digital copy online isn't going to completely solve the problem either.

I also agree with Chris in his indicated already, what do you do if you suffer a hardware failure such as with the motherboard or NIC and or your company issued laptop has come up for replacement (depending upon what part of the hardware you are tying the license to) that requires replacement of that component or the entire system? You have a file that you paid for that's now useless, or a surmountable hassle to re-obtain so that it will work on the new machine.

I also agree with John Unless you provide a solution similar to some software companies out there that also use hardware-based licensing (i.e. tied to a system's MAC address) where one can do a "license transfer" to another computer (via online registration, email or phone), and make that process easy, I don't see this working out favorably for either the magazine or the end user.

It seems to me that OGR will need to think this thrugh further to get a full year paid subscription out of some for the digital edition of OGR magazine I for one will go this way once all the issues have been resolved but for now I will do a as needed.

Thanks Rich

Will it play on any PC? Or just windows 7? A password protected Acrobat pdf file would be a more consumer friendly option. Other formats will rule out a certain percentage of your potential customers.

quote:

Candidly, I had not thought about those of you that travel a lot and use a laptop on the road for entertainment. I will look into what may be involved in allowing the use of two machines on a single subscription.

thank you Rich; however, in my case, I usually end up either upgrading my hardware or software at least once a year. I also use two computers at home (laptop and desktop) and I do use my office computer durning lunch.
Viewing the on line version may work, and I do not believe I am saying this; however, a type of dongle or pki solution might be appropriate for those of us who utilize multiple computers.

I had temporarily closed this thread while I gathered some additional information. I'm glad I did that because I learned a few new things about this today. Keep in mind that while we are committed to publishing the OGR Digital Edition, we are also climbing a learning curve as it relates to the process of publishing an on-line magazine.

Here's the most important thing I learned this morning, and it is critical...

When we publish the OGR Digital Edition, you will be able to read the magazine on ANY computer that's connected to the Internet. You will log in to read the Digital Edition just as you log in here to post. It will not matter what kind of computer you use, what operating system you use...if you can connect to the internet you'll be able to read the OGR Digital Edition.

Whew...glad we solved that one!

Thanks for keeping the open mind with this and acknowledging the learning curve.


Even iTunes (Apple) has moved to a DRM-free model as of this past April.

Like many here have expressed, I too am one of those who while I have a home computer, my iMac, I also have my laptop (MacBook Pro) which pretty much duplicates my home setup.

Even before Apple went to DRM-free, I could freely authorize up to 5 computers on my account, so I needn't worry about deciding which computer to donwload songs or audio books, or video to.

Protecting your work is very important, and I think most here agree.

Perhaps, as some have suggested, sell it as a license for up to X number of machines under one account.

An example would be an online music transcription service I belong to.

Any lead sheets I purchase come with a "license" to print 3 copies before I need to re-purchase the material. Perhaps this model may work for you and make everyone happy.

Again, thank you for keeping an open mind on this.

I am excited about this new medium for reading OGR, as it fits perfectly with my lifestyle....as long as it's not tied to one machine.

Heck i wouldn't mind password protection, granted it can be defeated and broken like anything, and I wouldn't mind a s minimal subscription for the digital AS LONG as i got my paper copy for filing.

Thanks for turning thread back on.

One question regarding the DRM. Let's say I have all my issues stored on one of my computers. Will the collection as a whole be searchable? To me, that's the biggest benefit of having things in digital form. I have 40 years' worth of the TCA's TCQ stored on disk, so I can find articles in seconds. In fact, the more obscure the topic, the faster I can find it.

If the DRM causes the files to be encrypted, that may make such searches more difficult to perform.

These days I am going through my 1990 magazines and finding information that is presently useful. Now, I store these and, over the years, have a lot of paper.

So, I would be interested in being able to retrieve information digitally.

I would like it to work that I can digitally access whatever magazines I subscribed to, just like having the hard copies.

I would consider paying extra to have full access to the entire library.

But, I can't see paying for a subscription with no right down the road to view the magazines I subscribed to, nor in limiting the use to a single computer terminal. Yet, I don't expect that proprietary infomration should be given away free.

So, please strike an acceptable balance.

Thanks,

Mark

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Let's say I have all my issues stored on one of my computers.

The issues will not be stored on your computer, they will be stored ON-LINE. There will be no need to download anything. All issues will be fully searchable. By keeping the files on-line as opposed to downloading them, there IS NO DRM INVOLVED.

A question was asked via Email about printing articles. You will be able to print anything you want out of the pages of the OGR Digital Edition. If you have a program that allows you to make PDF files, you can print pages as PDF files for storage and future reference.

To see how this is going to work, CLICK HERE. This will take you to a sample copy of "FITTED" magazine, which is all about New Era hats. I know it's not trains, but the OGR Digital Edition will use this same interface, so play around with this and you'll see how easy it is to use. You can click the bottom corner of a page to turn it, or you can click the "BACK" and "NEXT" arrows in the toolbar. Click on the print button and you'll see how easy it will be to print pages of articles you want to have in hard-copy. Click on the other buttons so you get to know the interface better.

Be sure to check the New Era baseball hat video on page 5!

Rich, Thanks for the example link.

I have a question though, what happens in 5 years or 15 years (or in the case of Mark (barrister2u)-29 years), will the magazines still be accessible? Will OGR want to pay for the storage/bandwidth/etc for the content to still be viewable and/or searchable

This is one of the questions when it comes to web-only access or even with DRM, what happens in the future?

Gee, Rich, glad ya did your homework BEFORE you announced the new adventure! Always good to stir the pot up and then find your ring on your finger!

I just hope a way is found that insures content creators get paid and satisfies the user community.

I think this is a great solution. If you want to view them online, you can pay extra for that feature. If not, you can keep getting the magazine like normal. No DRM is involved so this is fantastic news!

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I have a question though, what happens in 5 years or 15 years (or in the case of Mark (barrister2u)-29 years), will the magazines still be accessible? Will OGR want to pay for the storage/bandwidth/etc for the content to still be viewable and/or searchable

I would think eventually when they are part of the OGR digital archives there would be a time when they are taken off the web. If you haven't pdf'd them by then you could buy the digital archive. Now you'll say I already paid once but you could have saved it.

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I would think eventually when they are part of the OGR digital archives there would be a time when they are taken off the web. If you haven't pdf'd them by then you could buy the digital archive. Now you'll say I already paid once but you could have saved it.

Ya.... I keep hoping that I can buy a license to content and free myself of being tied to the delivery medium.

ie. Record to cassette tape, to cdrom to mp3. I can understand when there is a cost involved (ie materials of the record, tape etc.) but once things go digital that cost is a one time cost. In the case of OGR I'd like to be able to take the digital content and save it for myself, and not buy the same content over again on CDROM. Makes me feel like content providers are trying to double dip. Actually, it's not a feeling as they are! In the case of OGR though I don't feel too bad as I highly doubt anybody is getting rich, but when we talk about music that's an entirely different story.

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have a question though, what happens in 5 years or 15 years (or in the case of Mark (barrister2u)-29 years), will the magazines still be accessible? Will OGR want to pay for the storage/bandwidth/etc for the content to still be viewable and/or searchable

I refuse to believe it's been 29 years since I first saw these magazines. Why, it seems just like yesterday.

Best, Mark

I'm glad the DPM matter is settled. I for one am looking forward to the Digital OGR. However......I'M STLL WAITING FOR, OGR Digital Archives Vol. 7 & 8

Is OGR thinking of offering the magazine to Amazon's Kindle or Sony's version of electronic books? I understand you can buy a subscription to many magazines that way.

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Gee, Rich, glad ya did your homework BEFORE you announced the new adventure! Always good to stir the pot up and then find your ring on your finger!

Still grinding that axe, I see...