Here is the link:
http://www.mth-railking.com/vi...1409updatev&size=big

Scott Smith

Mmmmmm, drooling.......

And those aren't bad engines either

I wonder how they will stack up to Atlas's? Will we see a GP-35 war?

Great sounds on the video, really like the horn, hope they sound that good in actual running.

I hate to say it..

But... is it sitting rather high? (gap)

looks fine to me- a beautiful engine for sure!!

quote:

But... is it sitting rather high? (gap)

I notice that, too. And, the trucks still look too short.

Fred

The gap is very noticeable to me from the pictures from the MTH website.

Regards,
Swafford

The trucks are too short. Ugh.

http://ogaugerr.infopop.cc/eve...21021474/m/159102571

she did say,.... tony lash up

rat

NYC's are nice.
Now if I could only get these versions in MTH ....

quote:

Originally posted by SIRT:
NYC's are nice.
Now if I could only get these versions in MTH ....

Something that would probably make me end my DCS ban on my layout.

Very nice; I like the start up sounds.

How come the PRR didn't put the PENNSYLVANIA lettering on these engines?

Rick

quote:

I wonder how they will stack up to Atlas's?

Well Since I have the Atlas O PRR gp35's In the detail, I see some differences.
Besides what was said above,I noticed:

incorrect front green markers on powered unit

the see-through air intake grills look too recessed behind the cab

notice the overpresentation of the MTH marker light housings on the hoods compared to the Atlas O EL unit.

In the video, it seems that MTH ADDED the correct PRR signal Box on the engineers side of the front hood! Nice touch!

member: TCA

Didn't all railroads use green marker lights on the front of their locomotives when on the mainline?

I thought this was why manufacturers were putting green on the "front" and red on the "rear" when in motion.

I only ever see red-tinted marker lenses though when I look at photos from the 1960s and onward. I can't really tell because they're off in pictures because most photos are taken in daylight. I could just be seeing things though.

I watched these switch all the time as a kid. This model has the wrong sounds, it should not sound like a GP9.
GP35 switching

quote:

Originally posted by SPSF:
I watched these switch all the time as a kid. This model has the wrong sounds, it should not sound like a GP9.
GP35 switching

If you read the comments, someone said it sounds like a turbocharged GP40. Needless to say, the units in the video are from modern times and probably had a new prime mover put inside.

I'm not saying MTH's GP35 sounds right or not...but the youtube video may not be proof they're wrong.

Looks great, but I don't know about that gap. I have one of these on order with Mr. Sutter - can't wait to see it in person.

quote:

Originally posted by DaveJfr0:

quote:

Originally posted by SPSF:
I watched these switch all the time as a kid. This model has the wrong sounds, it should not sound like a GP9.
GP35 switching

If you read the comments, someone said it sounds like a turbocharged GP40. Needless to say, the units in the video are from modern times and probably had a new prime mover put inside.

I'm not saying MTH's GP35 sounds right or not...but the youtube video may not be proof they're wrong.

Nah. if anything it should sound closer a SD45 since it's turbocharged, a GP9 is not turbocharged - and that's what the MTH engine sounds like.

quote:

Originally posted by SPSF:

quote:

Originally posted by DaveJfr0:

quote:

Originally posted by SPSF:
I watched these switch all the time as a kid. This model has the wrong sounds, it should not sound like a GP9.
GP35 switching

If you read the comments, someone said it sounds like a turbocharged GP40. Needless to say, the units in the video are from modern times and probably had a new prime mover put inside.

I'm not saying MTH's GP35 sounds right or not...but the youtube video may not be proof they're wrong.

Nah. if anything it should sound closer a SD45 since it's turbocharged, a GP9 is not turbocharged - and that's what the MTH engine sounds like.

Ahh, did not know GP35s were turbocharged.

The GP35s in that video have 567Ds... Not what the model has.

As for the class lights, on the prototype, you had three colors. White, Green, and Red. For use in the days of block operators...white was second section following, green I think was extra, and red was for use as a marker. After CTC, usually they only needed to use the red.

Some of Conrail's newer power didn't have class lights, but rather just red colored "markers" where the class lights were placed.

The horn is a nice M3, but not what this motor would've had. The 2258 caried an S-3L.

quote:

Originally posted by Jeffrey Sessa:
The GP35s in that video have 567Ds... Not what the model has.

As for the class lights, on the prototype, you had three colors. White, Green, and Red. For use in the days of block operators...white was second section following, green I think was extra, and red was for use as a marker. After CTC, usually they only needed to use the red.

Some of Conrail's newer power didn't have class lights, but rather just red colored "markers" where the class lights were placed.

The horn is a nice M3, but not what this motor would've had. The 2258 caried an S-3L.

I am confused on the class lights. This link indicates 2 ways to use class lights:
http://dsop.com/pipermail/prr-...-January/000261.html

All I get follows what I said earlier;

"The red, green, and white classification light colors, therefore would be:

White - for an extra;
Green - section of train following;
Red - Loco is rear of train and running in reverse."

quote:

Originally posted by Jeffrey Sessa:
All I get follows what I said earlier;

"The red, green, and white classification light colors, therefore would be:

White - for an extra;
Green - section of train following;
Red - Loco is rear of train and running in reverse."

Dislexia or something must have kicked in. Nevermind. You are correct. I assume the class lights would not be on if no section was to follow, especially considering freight engines. I guess I need to figure out how to turn off the class lights when I operate trains. I don't have enough trains to run separate sections, haha.

quote:

Originally posted by Jeffrey Sessa:
The GP35s in that video have 567Ds... Not what the model has.

The horn is a nice M3, but not what this motor would've had. The 2258 caried an S-3L.

My bad, the Santa Fe GP35's were turbocharged - the MTH model sounds to be non-turbo or the early roots blower type.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vrVxpMI1vX0

GP9
Of course with an East coast manufacturer - East coast roads and prototypes will always have precedence over west coast roads

This message has been edited. Last edited by: SPSF,

I watched the video twice, not blown away by what I saw, even though I ordered one. These videos are lame, though, I like the stills better. Have to wait and see.


Rick

A non sequitor! That video of the BNSF GP39E...those were rebuilt with 645s, not 567's as the GP35 discussed in this thread.

Well the link for the MTH Video Alert has a broken link message.

As for the GP35, they did sound very much like GP40's. The ex-SOU units in the video, they may have had new 645 assemblies put on but I doubt the old prime mover was replaced. The GP35's weak point wasn't the prime mover but the then new traction motors when they were delivered. As time went on the traction motors were traded out and probably substituted with GP40 traction motors.

The marker lights had four aspects actually, with one being dark or not turned on. When they were dark, the train was running on a timetable schedule. During day light hours, flags were used and every engine had a set of white, green and red flags stored with the spare air hoses, wrenches and fusee's. Jeffrey's explanation for the colors is correct. White for extra's, green for second section of a timetable train following and red for rear end marker. The red rear markers were for light engine moves or as helpers. As railroads got away from timetable operation and everything was considered extra, the FRA did away with the rule for having the class lights even on the engine. To make up for the lack of class lights the trailing end of the engine would have the headlight on dim.

In the early 1990's SP de-turboed some of their GP35's essentially making them GP28's and they sound much like a GP38. BN did rebuild their GP30's and GP35's and reclassed them as GP39#-2's. IIRC BN had GP39M-2 and GP39E-2's depending on who did the rebuild job. I'll defer to Jeffrey's statement on the replacement of the prime movers.

Greg

I wonder if Mr Wolfe will, at some future date, bring a lawsuit against Atlas for infringement(s) on this model as Atlas has already made this model.

I think SHE is a "7" and so is the model.

Great sounds, good looking loco.

But I don't get why manufacturers are still making locos with these giant gaps, particularly after all the discussion on the boards. The gaps can be minimized, and have been on some locos, so they are not inevitable. Ease of manufacturing? So the loco can go from level to 6% incline without a vertical transition or easement? How many of us go from level to steep incline anyway with no transition? Not me - I ease through 1% - 2% - 3% - to max out at 4% incline on my small layout.

Why these giant gaps? Its dissappointing, perhaps I'll drop down to "S" scale.

quote:

perhaps I'll drop down to "S" scale.

It will probably be less expensive.

Fred

quote:

Originally posted by Jeffrey Sessa:
A non sequitor! That video of the BNSF GP39E...those were rebuilt with 645s, not 567's as the GP35 discussed in this thread.

All that I can find is they were rebuilt as GP30u. It doesn't really matter - the point is there's a HUGE difference between Turbocharged and Non-turbocharged soundwise

I will be ordering an Alaska unit.

quote:

Originally posted by R.R.:
I think SHE is a "7" and so is the model.

I watched in fast forward and came up with 8.5

I have the Alaska unit and it has an excellent sound file......for a GP-38!
Not correct sound for a GP-35. For the correct sound go to the proto sound page and download file PO7IPF3_GP30_ALL070626aF2x.

when do you lose site that these are really just toys, and want them exact,I think that they look great but that may just be a untrained eye, is it the cost,or just how they look on the layout.

Ah, I like it,Atlas makes a Mopac GP35, but I want to stay with just DCS, hope that MTH comes out with the Missouri Pacific Screaming Eagle sheme next round!
Dan

quote:

Originally posted by B+M FAN:
when do you lose site that these are really just toys, and want them exact,I think that they look great but that may just be a untrained eye, is it the cost,or just how they look on the layout.

Are they really toys or are they models to some extent? Thats an argument that I've seen time and again on here. I say when MTH started to produce accurate dimensions, fixed pilots, lots of extra fine detail, that these toys have to some extent become models to a lot of us that have the operating toy abilities. The fact that they are supposed to be scale (a scale model or scale toy) is a reason that drives scale guys to have them exact. Never mind the third rail is there. So what, that's how the majority of O scale trains were and are made. Doesn't change the fact that companies are focusing attention to details, dimensions, and other tidbits that I believe turn these toys into models. I think also it has partially to do with some guys coming from HO who got everything already detailed in a smaller scale for much less and had to do little work to get things "right" so to speak.

I used to not care, and then for some reason I started to want my railroad to look more realistic and scale. My personality has become somewhat detail-oriented and I've come to notice things after reading books and studying lots of photos. This comes with time and experience, and you have to seek it out. There are those on here who are very informed on trains and just don't care. That's perfectly fine, but there are others here that have had similar background in trains and do want the detail after having seen them, rode on them, or worked with them in real life. Nothing wrong with that either. Unless the price is hurt drastically by tooling investments, etc, it can't hurt to get the details right and the trucks right, etc. Tooling like trucks can be spread among a large population of product.

Some people on here it seems has also gotten the scale bug after seeing how good it looks...check out Rich Battista's layout. He runs fixed pilot and kadees. Looks great and looks more like the real thing.

Some of the scale guys notice when things don't quite look right and I may be speaking for just myself instead of the 'scale' guys, but we just want more realism for both the amount we pay and want items to be truly scale if they are listed as scale. A mostly Scale GP-35 with non-scale trucks will look out of place to many and is truly not a scale premier item as indicated...somewhat false advertising IMHO.

I know tooling is expensive, but to not ostracize part of MTH's scale market (3RS, 2R), I personally think it would be in MTH's best interest to invest in scale truck tooling as these trucks can be used across a wide range of different locomotives and they will get their investment back. I'd say sooner rather than later as they are currently losing market share with folks who care about such items - 3RS and 2R. There may be 3R's out there that care as well and I am not excluding them.

A current circumstance with MTH trucks again is on their new scale Premier U25B. The scale guys are trying to let MTH know about the U25B's trucks. They are not currently scale. MTH knows there's demand, but there has to be a good group of us that voice our opinion to show that the demand is high enough to warrant the business solution. Hopefully it can be changed in time as its a new model to O scale and has strong potential to do well in all current and future road names.

Perhaps someone should chime in here showing the new GP35 trucks compared to either prototype or say another model of them (I think the AtlasO ones are good, right?) and just show visually what Pete and others are talking about and further why this upsets a group of us.

quote:

Originally posted by B+M FAN:
when do you lose site that these are really just toys, and want them exact,I think that they look great but that may just be a untrained eye, is it the cost,or just how they look on the layout.

You know, if it was an FEF or Big Boy that had the wrong whistle people would be all over it - so at least throw us "modern" (GP35 modern? LOL!) guys a bone and don't do the one size fits all with the sounds.

Sure, they have a third rail, run on electricity, don't burn diesel fuel etc etc - heard all those arguments.

Anyone else notice the drop bottom gondolas in the consist? They look pretty good. I guess this means both the gondolas and the GP35s are probably on schedule for the targeted DEC 09 date.

B+M fan has basically stated a fact of life, Lionel and MTH produce for the tinplate/ collector market and large quantities of these models never leave the boxes. It is true they have come a long way towards realistic looking models but manufacturing and costs dictate production. Notice MTH still uses the frame mounted handrail system, the -2 diesel models cater mostly to the 3rail scale operator who wants fixed pilots, yes some are run on 2 rail layouts but MTHs market is three rail. Lionel has produced several die cast cars that rival most scale cars even their Husky Stack was built 1/2 inch short for reasons known only to Lionel. The forum is a good place to let the manufactures know what we want just bear in mind we represent a very small amount of their market, each change we can get them to make is a big step forward.
Hibar

Dave,

I do not have a GP35, but the picture below would demonstrate clearly the difference between the non scale MTH Trucks and the scale Atlas ones. I saw the GP35s in person and thought they were a terrible model, as the trucks look even worse on a hood unit. The new GP35s should not be in the Premier line as they are clearly not scale. Half a model does not count. Bottom line, it depends who you are and what you enjoy. For some a great looking toy, for others a poor rendition of the prototype. MTH can do better as evidence look at their 6 axle units. We are trying to raise awareness to help MTH get back on track.

Pete, that photo is not the clearest. Perhaps take two separate photos of the units and combine them to show a side by side comparison at the same photo distance.

I also think it would help if someone took photos of the MTH GP35s and put them on here...but are these even out yet? Maybe SandPatchTom has a photo of one from York?

Dave,

As I said above I saw them in person, they are out. Just take a look at all the air in front of the MTH NP Passenger F trucks. This illustrates the same look on the 35's.

MTH

Atlas

Thanks Pete. Thats the shot I was looking for. It just wasn't as obvious as the trucks MTH put on their U25B prototype.

Not to be annoying, but I assume you took a ruler to the trucks and measured a significant difference and that its not the pilots creating an illusion.

quote:

Originally posted by Rixster:
How come the PRR didn't put the PENNSYLVANIA lettering on these engines?

Rick

I had asked that question before also, I was told they thought the merger with the NYC was eminent and they did not want to spend money on the lettering only to have it painted over. So I was told, sounds logical to me.
John

quote:

Originally posted by Rixster:
How come the PRR didn't put the PENNSYLVANIA lettering on these engines?

Rick

The PRR second generation diesels were delivered with keystones instead of "Pennsylvania" beginning in 1962. First generation diesels received the keystones after that date when/if painting was required. The GP35s were delivered between May '64 and April '65. The merger that created the PenCentral was 1Feb68.

Dave,

Yes, nearly a scale foot off.

Pete

It is 9 scale inches. A scale modeler really ought to be precise about such things.