I have 3 questions about the new F3s and F7s.

1) Are the axles removable like the new Atlas or Diesels?
2) Do the Dummies use the same trucks as the powered diesels? In other words, can I install motors in the existing trucks?
3) Do the diaphragms some how move side to side, in some kind of pivoting motion?

Thank you for any help you can give.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Lisa Marie Tahtaras,

Has anyone purchased the new Lionel F7 or F3 diesels?

quote:

Originally posted by Lisa Marie Tahtaras:
I have 3 questions about the new F3s and F7s.

1) Are the axles removable like the new Atlas or Diesels?
2) Do the Dummies use the same trucks as the powered diesels? In other words, can I install motors in the existing trucks?
3) Do the diaphragms some how move side to side, in some kind of pivoting motion?

Thank you for any help you can give.

Lisa Marie,

I have the scale Lionel F3 A & B unit in Santa Fe livery.

1) I don't know if the axles are removable.

2) It appears to me that the dummies do use the same trucks. There is a hole in the center large enough for a gear shaft. The truck side frames are the same.

3) The diaphragms on mine do move side to side as you described.

Jim

What is the street price for a dummy?

quote:

Originally posted by Hudson J1e:
What is the street price for a dummy?

$125-$140.

Thanks Jim,

If you look at the bottoms of the trucks, there would probably be 8 small screws, 2 in front and 2 just behind each axle. This does not include the 2 mounting screws that attach the motor and the 3rd rail pickup.

quote:

$125-$140.

Thanks Jim. That's not a bad price. Perhaps I will pick one up in the future.

quote:

Originally posted by Lisa Marie Tahtaras:
Thanks Jim,

If you look at the bottoms of the trucks, there would probably be 8 small screws, 2 in front and 2 just behind each axle. This does not include the 2 mounting screws that attach the motor and the 3rd rail pickup.

Lisa Marie,

Each axle has 4 screws holding it down, and each side frame has 2 screws securing it on the dummy trucks. All seem easily removable.I didn't even realize that the diaphragms swiveled until you mentioned it. I've had the train for well over a year!



Phil,

I think Charles Ro has/had them on the inexpensive side of that range. I paid $140 and got to wait over a year for my B unit to arrive...whatchyagonnado?

Jim

Please note re dummy units:

Unlike the Atlas O units, there are NO:

Gears

third rail pick ups

lights

wiring


you are just buying a shell and hollow trucks

member: TCA

That's correct. Mine has no lights, gears or pick ups.

quote:

Originally posted by prrhorseshoecurve:
Please note re dummy units:

Unlike the Atlas O units, there are NO:

Gears

third rail pick ups

lights

wiring


you are just buying a shell and hollow trucks

Thanks guys. I was contemplating picking up The Lionel Western Pacific F7s, to pull my California Zephyr. I had heard a lot of good things about the new Lionel F units. I also would like to try out the Legacy control. The negatives on the Lionel units are that just the front engine is powered and has sound. I can't readily add power and Legacy control to the dummy units. I may wait for Atlas, to come out with WP F7s. Hopefully they will have fixed pilot versions with TMCC by then and I will just have to change the wheels.

quote:

Hopefully they will have fixed pilot versions with TMCC by then and I will just have to change the wheels.

Doesn't Atlas have that now in 3 rail? Lisa just get the 3 rail version and convert the trucks over to 2 rail.

Last night I checked the newest Lionel catalog but no non-powered units were listed. They did have a F7 "B" unit with Lagacy for $300. I forget the road name.

Thanks for tip about the gears and pick-ups.

The only thing I don't like about the Lionel F unit is I believe the ladders on the side of the cab are attached to the trucks instead of the frame. Please correct me if I am wrong. I don't know how hard it would be to mount them on the cab. I have an extra set of Weaver trucks and I was thinking that maybe without too much trouble I would throw those truck in the Lionel unit and have a powered F unit on the cheap.

Sorry for the delay in jumping in on this thread but I somehow missed it.

Lisa, the new scale Lionel F-3/7's are fantastic models. I can't say enough about them. I've only seen the MTH F's in photos but I think the Lionels are nicer. The chicken wire screening on the F-3's is some of the best I've seen and can be removed to weather behind it. I had JoeF 2R my ABA set so I have the TMCC guts available if you want to add Legacy to some of yours. It includes the board(s), smoke unit(s), and tons of wires and what-not. I did keep the small insert(s) that go in the nose of the "A" units with the marker light LED's as I want to incorporate these into my DCC operation.

Phil, your right about the lower side ladders being attached to the trucks; but they're only held on by one screw. The rear ladders are screwed to the frame and are slightly longer so I'm hoping to pick up some of the rear ladders from Lionel and mount them to the frame above the trucks and get rid of the stock units. They will look great, not swivel with the trucks and they are the proper length. Everything else on these locos is up to par or better than the Atlas locos IMHO.

Butch

Hi Phil,

As far as I know, Atlas will do the pilot conversion for you, at extra cost. I am not aware of them selling, 3 rail diesels with fixed pilots, as of yet. The Lionel F7 set, comes with an ABA units. The first A unit is powered and has the Legacy control system. They also sell single powered B units with legacy. At some point, I hope to kitbash an FP7, out of a couple of old Atlas F9s, that I have saved for that purpose. On the WP, the California Zephyr was pulled by an FP7a on the nose and a F7b and F7a. At this time no one makes an FP7a in O scale.

quote:

Hi Phil,

As far as I know, Atlas will do the pilot conversion for you, at extra cost. I am not aware of them selling, 3 rail diesels with fixed pilots, as of yet.

Lisa, you are correct for Atlas diesels with hand rails (hood units) but the 3 rail Atlas cab units (F's, Erie Builts, etc) come with an option for fixing the pilot to the locomotive. You have to do it yourself but Atlas includes all of the parts in with their "A" units. So in the case of F units or Erie Builts all you have to do is change the trucks and you will have a 2R TMCC locomtoive with a fixed pilot. At least this is what I have been lead to believe. I am 99% sure about this. Someone please correct me if I am wrong.

I remember Pete K. very easily attaching the pilots on his Atlas Erie builts and I also remember Norm Ch. attaching the pilots to his Atlas F units.

So it seems that to get the Lionel dummy F unit I have to buy the A-B-A set? Darn, just can't afford that right now. I was trying to do this on the cheap.

Hi Lisa,

WP typically ran their section of the Zephyr with one A unit and two B units. Until the FP7's showed up it was F3's in the lime light. WP's FP7's came with passenger B units but still ran in the A-B-B configuration. Granted there are a few times they ran A-B-A and they even ran a couple of times with a U30B and F7B unit with a steam heater car. Depending on the time frame you are modeling an A-B-B set of F3's would be the cats meow.

Greg

Thank you Greg, I did not know that. Now to find a ABB set of F3s to use. Who has made scale WP F3s?

I was sorely tempted to get the Lionel F3's. They even had the passenger red wings on the nose.

Greg

Maybe Atlas will do a WP Phase II F3 cab and two boosters, with simulated stainless steel panels instead of silver paint. One could hope.

Twould be nice. I have been hoping that Atlas would. If not, I will make an FP7A out of a couple of older Atlas F9s.